Top Rated Poker Rooms

^ 85 Comments...

1. Mamma C
   January 11th, 2008 at 2:53 am

   Well, thank you for the cartoon at least whilst you make us wait

2. blue
   January 14th, 2008 at 12:44 pm

   Freezing my antes off!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

3. Richard
   February 14th, 2008 at 11:39 am

   Collusion is a problem, but not as big as “inflation” and “insiders”. Its really simple. They inflate the hands so that people play more, get more excited and bet more, and so the percentages get screwed. AA vs any random hand (say 72) should be about 87% vs 12%, but in online games its about 65% vs 35%. Every hand has about 3 times more chances to hit compared to real life game. Lets say youll hit a straight 1 every 100 hands in real life (dont know the real odds) in online gaming youll get a straight 1 every 33 hands! but chances are also “triplified” that it wont be good to win!. Insiders are people who play for the company, to keep things running smoothly, to detect collusion, and to get more money, sure why not. I dont know if websites let u win for a while if u deposit cause ive never done that, all my online bankroll started from freerolls. Im still looking for a fair place to play, but guess itll never happen.

4. kdoggie67
   August 9th, 2008 at 5:08 pm

   If online poker were reputable, the B&M giants like Caesars and MGM would put up their own sites and back the necessary legislation to legallize the money-transfer laws that currently are hindering the US players. They know there are just too many problems with cheating, collusion, and randon number generators, and thus they want nothing to do with online poker.

5. Alex
   September 12th, 2008 at 6:00 am

   I think you guys are right about online poker…….I think we have a situation here where online sites are not “rigged for any particular individual, but rigged in general for “action” or what they call “juiced”. Now I have been playing online for years, admittedly….and I’m not a bad player at all. A matter of fact I consider myself a decent player…Like many other students of the game, I consider myself well read in poker theory, odds, strategies, etc. The one thing that we can’t forget is that the online poker websites make tons of money and that by “rigging” the lower limits for action they generate more excitement, this tends to bring players back to play again. The other side of the coin is that it is impossible to PROVE that it is rigged, and the owners of these online sites know this……so its a perfect situation for them…they know they have somehow juiced the program ( even in the slightest way ), they can keep raking in the money without fear that they would be discovered. Again if they can slightly modify ( juice ) the programs, they could achieve their results monetarily and at the same time avoid the possibility of detection. Another justification they give is the ” more hands per hour” reason which is valid, but herein lies the problem ” by telling players they play more hands per hour, it in fact gives total COVER or false justification for the countless and endless suck outs, bad beats and miracle hands that in my experience still seem to happen much too often than coincidence. But again …people tell me…” Oh no…its just your imagination…..your too paranoid”……. It is truly the perfect scheme to play….juice the hands for increased action, knowing that no one can prove your cheating…..the perfect SCHEME……On a personal note ( my opinion )
   I think that the juicing happens primarily at the low limits like one of the posters said earlier …I agree totally with that. The possible reasoning for this is that they don’t want to lose their higher limit players because they naturally bring in a higher rake. Ive learned a few lessons in life and one of them is that wherever money is involved….never rule out the presence of corruption…and online poker is no exception.

6. ub_cheats
   October 25th, 2008 at 10:13 am

   hell yes online poker is rigged, i agree its not rigged for any one player, but only to a point, if you own a site and i work for you and i get into a tourny or a cash game and have knowledge of the cards and such, how much do i win for your site and collect my say 20%, but i agree that the average smuck gets no advantage, other than dragging a pot to keep him paying the rake, ever notice that in a cash game and a idiot player thats dumped his money hand after hand will hit a monster just as hes about to go broke?? to keep him playing and paying the rake, personally on ultimate bet and pokerstars at any all in, (and these # taken over a 2 year period) i have the best hand 98% of the time and lose with it 96% of the time, sorry but these #s dont add up, in my opinion, playing online poker is like watching a poker highlight reel, hand after hand of monsters and outragous bad beats, poker is not a half court jumper at the buzzer, at least its not suppost to be

7. You guys are fucking crazy
   November 24th, 2008 at 1:13 am

   Online poker would make them the same amount of money whether the action was, “juiced,” or not. That’s a completely stupid idea. They have nothing to gain.

   The rake for each pot is capped. The more hands that get played, the more they make. Hands with lots of action take longer. Therefore, lot’s of action would LOSE them money.

   The best way for them to, “juice” the system would be to somehow make the pre-flop action make the pot big enough for max rake, then have a bet and everyone else fold on the flop.

   If you think the poker sites have any advantage in rigging these games in any way, you don’t understand the industry. Also, it’s impossible to keep stuff like this under wraps. Someone would’ve talked, especially if every site were doing it. That’s too many people involved for it to be kept quiet.

   p.s. “Low limits have more ridiculous action and suckouts.” Duh.

8. YGAFC --- Must not play very often.
   December 11th, 2008 at 5:45 pm

   I know for a fact its juiced. I’ve actually talked with some of the programmers, and yes they have told me its to keep people coming back. Someone pointed out in this article about the all-in wins and such. Every time I go all-in with A-K, K-K, A-A, someone will call with a garbage hand like K-J not suited, and hit. And if your a new player to the game watch the first day you play, you will win most of your hands, and suck out just as bad as the next person. But the next day, everything you gained, will probably disappear with bad beats. I tested this theory probably 35 times, with a number of new accounts, I’m a pretty good player, been known to win most multi-table tournys, or at least place in almost every one I’ve entered. I’ve had my share of bad beats, but nothing like this. I wish someone would come up with a better random generated system, cause this one is shit.

9. shrimpshackshooter
   December 13th, 2008 at 8:02 pm

   online poker is rigged. ive played far too many games online and have seen countless suckouts, not to mention the amount of times ive rec’d quads and a straight flush in the same day.lol. its a flawed algorithm…and yes i agree with ygafc, fresh players with fresh deposits always seem to win simply because pstars or whoever it is wants to get them back and get them addicted. i think they control cashflow and how much u win through ip addresses. it is a flawed algorithm. nevertheless there are many idiots to be taking advantage of, which makes it somewhat profitable. i think the only way to combat the rig is either colluding yourself, or play multiple games at a time.

10. papajoey21
    January 10th, 2009 at 1:20 pm

    Well guys you are all right,I have been playing and dealing poker for 38 years now.I can tell you without a doubt that online poker sites are all cheats,each and every one of them.The game you see online is a farce,nowhere near honest.You have all them guys like Bill rini who works for full tilt going all over the Internet saying prove it,were all babies and bad players,wheres are hand histories.All this amounts to crap,just like a politician.Online poker is about as honest as rob blagojevich,the govenor of ILL.Why do they cheat?If they did not all the good players would bust the bad players and they would have about 80% less people playing.They have to protect the weak or the party is over and they know it.I have had a standing offer for 4 years now and cant find anybody to take it.All these people who stick up for online poker will not take my offer,why is that.My offer is this,come play poker on my computer and log 100 hours of any level you want.at the end of the 100 hours whatever you lost online you ahve to give me 5 times the amount,whatever you ahve won online I will give you 10 times the amount,sounds like a great deal to me all you backers of online poker.the only requirment is you play on my computer.I will give anybody that deal including any pro who may want to try.why do they cheat people,because they can..The Indian gaming comission that regulates them is a joke,you dont think they are on the take?Guys its all a setup to take your money,please please please dont play..Guys I know several groups of guys at the casino I work for who sit at home with headsets on and run over the games.They are the least of your worries..Nice post Frank,I hope we can keep a few people from palying anyway..

    Joe

11. hook118
    January 10th, 2009 at 2:01 pm

    yeah it is rigged but it is still fun to play. anecdoteally i have won alot of money playing but that was about 2 years ago. maybe it was because i played alot loser and i was constantly sucking out on people. now i just go all in with qq and lose to qj or aa and lose to 85. it is pretty sick how often the worst hand wins in pre flop all ins.

    it seems to me if the website wanted to prove it was legit all it had to do was keep track of preflop all ins and see if the best hand did win the percentages it was supposed to win.

    it just does not seem to me i win with premium hands enough to keep wanting to play them. i dont get excited when i see aa or kk anymore i just think about how i am going to lose.

12. shrimpshackshooter
    January 16th, 2009 at 2:50 pm

    please we need to sue them. someone help.

13. Tom Dwyer
    January 22nd, 2009 at 9:31 am

    Frank – Contact me please…

    “xfilespoker” on the forum

    I think something can be done..

14. ford
    January 22nd, 2009 at 8:43 pm

    The ones who claim that on line poker isn’t rigged, and that we’re just a bunch of sore losers who cannot play poker, are the real losers. It is so obvious to anyone with the slightest mathematical sense that on line poker is rigged. There are imho two ways (maybe more) the poker sites (read pokerstars imc) rig the game: Favourising the new/bad players and favourising the bigstack.

    I am not a poker pro and will probably (for sure) never be, but in 2007 and 2008 my officialpokerrankings stats have put me in the top 2% and 9% respectively, so I know how to play poker and have a nice financial supplement to my steady job income. However, in 2006 when I started playing poker, I didn’t have a clue when it comes to playing poker. Even so I managed to boost my initial $100 deposit up to an “impressive” $1800 bankroll in less than two weeks – playing $22 sng’s. I thought: Wow, what will this come to, this is so easy. I just couldn’t lose. A week later it was all gone.

    I have reviewed some of my earliest hand histories, and I am truly amazed. 1. I play so bad, 2. I get dealt incredible hands, 3. I suck out big time. AA eight times in my first three sit’n'go’s, runner runner straights/flushes, smaller pairs that crack overpairs. I could hardly lose a hand if my life depended on it. I had no concept of poker, but I thought I was sooo good.

    Therefore the downfall hit me so much harder. I wasn’t dealt all those great hands anymore. My A7 didn’t suck out on AK. And my pre flop all ins with pocket threes didn’t seem to work anymore. The fact is: I was lured into the intizing world of on line poker. And my slump was just bad luck, I was sure.
    I was almost $4000 down until I had learnt enough basic poker strategy and until i started breaking even.

    My point is: The poker sites give you every possible advantage you can think of when you start playing, so that you wont lose everything immediately and quit the game for good. You have felt the sweetness of winning, and you’ll keep on playing even though the harsh realities of your real poker skills eventually strike you. Of course the advantage given to the beginner isn’t restricted to that. The genuine poker donk who hasn’t got a clue has to get some aid cardwise in order for him to fell that he still has game.

    Next endgame/bubble play your aces are beaten by a pot committed player with T4os look up your opponent’s stats. 9/10 times he is a big time losing player. Yeah yeah, I know pocket aces aren’t unbeatable, but when it happens too often, there is a pattern. In a recent sng I was all in 11 times (3-handed and in the money) vs. one particular player. All coinflips with noone more than 60% favourite. I lost all of them! I know that stranger things have happened, but added to the fact that he had absolutely no idea of how to play poker, and that he had sucked out throughout the tourney, it seems strange. He was in the bottom five percent on opr, but Pokerstars had decided that he was to win now – at any cost. Now you ask yourself how I could lose eleven all ins. Well, he was so weak/tight that I stole his blinds with any hand, and he only called me when he had a decent hand or when his stack forced him to call.

    Letting the big stack win: Well, the sorry people (and/or poker site employees) who claim that poker isn’t rigged always argue that there is no reason to do it. They say that favourising the big stack will eliminate the small stack who will leave the table and thus wont pay rake anymore. That may be true when it comes to ring games – I am not a cash game player, but in sng’s and mtt’s there is every reason to get people eliminated as fast as possible. The more players who exit the tourneys asap the more players will enter new tourneys.
    I know that regulars at Stars know what I’m talking about. It is unbelievable the amount of bad beats you are delt by the big stack if you are short.

    Other strange things happen at Pokerstars. In a recent mtt, I wasn’t dealt an ace in 72 (seventytwo!) hands. Not ONE single ace. I dont know the probability of that happening, but I’ll suppose it’s 1/xxxxx. Yeah now give me your arguement that we play a lot of hands on line, so we can’t compare it to brm poker. Rubbish! Improbabilities that you wont see in a lifetime of playing live poker won’t become probable just because you play more hands per hour on line. I don’t multitable and I don’t play 20-30 hours a week, but I have seen enough weird stuff to last me a lifetime.

    Why don’t you just stop playing on line if it is so rigged? Well, I make money nevertheless. Just not as much as I should.

    Mark my words: In less than two years one or more of the biggest poker sites will be scandalised because their randon nummer generator will be exposed as not being so random anyway.

    Ps. I have flopped five royal flushes in three years of playing. Pretty good huh? Possible – yes, probable – no!

    Pps. Please don’t give me your variance nonsense. Yes, variance is for real, and it’s cruel, but the obvious cheating at pokerstars has nothing whatsoever to do with variance. The sad thing is that now I’ll get flamed by ignorants, people with no understanding of numbers and probabilities, players who wish to believe and pokerstars employees.

    GG GL

15. Pvenn
    January 23rd, 2009 at 4:15 pm

    I have to agree with you guys, this shit is rigged.

    In 2007 I was in the top 97% of online poker players according to the various websites out there. I played on Pokerstars in tournamnets only, and did really well. My biggest win as a $13000 first place in the $50K ($55 entry) gaurntee. the next day I won a 6 handed table tournamnet for another $3,000.

    My point? In 2007 I was a great player.

    2007 ended with a few more small tournament wins in Dec of 2007, all in the $500-$1000 range.

    2008 happens, and it all goes up in smoke.

    2008 was an ENDLESS… ENDLESS parade of Suckouts, uncanny, unreal shit that you should see once a year was happening every day, every week, every month.

    At first I thought it was just bad luck, maybe I was “due”. but it went on, and on and on. In real life games I did ok, I played in event #27 in the WSOP in 2008, and did ok, didnt make the money, but I won my SNG satelite to get in, and lost because of nervousness and making a dumb mistake, NOT because of suckouts.

    As 2008 continued into fall, and then winter, the suckout parade continued.

    When I say suckouts, I dont mean someone hitting their 12 outters on the river, I mean 1-3 out hits 5-7% shots… OVER.. and OVER… and OVER.

    Finall I said fuck it, left PS, switched to Full-Tilt 3 weeks ago.

    The bullshit suckouts have continued unabated. Now if I get AA or KK preflop, I expect to lose to the donk who just called my AI iwth Q-10 off, and I usually do.

    I went from a 97% player in 2007 to a 40% player in 2008. NOTHING changed in my game, if anything it probably got a little better.

    Now, in January 2009, I’m probably in the bottom 20%.

    Something is fishy in online poker, either that or I am (we are) the most unlucky sons of bitches in the world, and have been for at least a year.

16. papajoey21
    February 2nd, 2009 at 2:38 pm

    Well guys its good to see a few people who see what I have seen online,as I have stated above I have been in the game for 38 years and can tell you online poker is far from real..you can tell me about variance,more hands,hand histories,plain and simple,you are not getting random cards period.I wish it was for real believe me.Play at home in a big easychair,switch games anytime you want,switch levels,tourneys at your fingertips, a dream.Let me pose this questions in hopes for the future,If the U.S. made it legal and let U.S. casinos open online sites, have it regulated by the feds,would we get an honest game and random cards,is it possible?

    Joey Z

17. papajoey21
    February 2nd, 2009 at 2:39 pm

    BY THE WAY,NICE POST FORD!

18. Pvenn
    February 2nd, 2009 at 3:02 pm

    Papa, if it were regulated I believe the games would be legit.

    But until then, no way.

    I’ve saved all my history files from one month of FT play, I would love to get these imported into a DB and have some analysis run on all the suckouts. I tried by hand with excel, but it would be a HUGE undertaking.

    But this is the answer, if all the players on these piece of shit sites imported their hand histories, and if it were proven that 5-7% suckouts happen about half the time, or even 1/3 of the time, then that cinches it right there.

19. shrimpshackshoota
    February 7th, 2009 at 10:15 pm

    IT HAPPEND FOR THE 3RD TIME…over pr vs under pr, i hit my set on the flop, and they get turn river quads. only this last time it was a lil diff cause he had the set on the flop as well, but he just rivered me. now this has happened to me 3 times, and i have yet to do this to someone. are they rigging my ip addy or what….please someone wtf is going on. is this not proof its rigged?

20. papajoey21
    February 16th, 2009 at 7:46 am

    shrimp,
    As much as I hate to say it,3 hands are not enough to base anything on.I can assure you that you are being cheated and that online poker is not an honest game.they cheat cause they can and they know their game could be over at anytime.All we need is the U.S. to make it legal and it will be bye bye poker stars.they will go belly up along with all the other sites that are out there right now.So we still have to put on our pants and drive to our local casino if we want a fair game…

21. No more Online
    March 10th, 2009 at 5:12 pm

    Hi guys, It’s good to see so many people on here that are right on the mark. I’ve been playing online now for the past 6 years, and live for the past 10. I always had a feeling about the sites rigging for action and stuff, but kept playing thinking I could maybe learn the proper strategy for online. To this date I am probably about a 13k loser online. Anyway I have been done with it for some time and then my friend tempted me to play around on Poker Stars. As usual I deposited 100 played 10 cent 25 cent No Limit ring games. First two nights wasn’t getting anything major, just an even distribute of my fair share. I made 80 bucks, Day 3 comes around and just like always, I suddenly hit a brick wall. Now some might say oh variance..it’s just variance, I say really? always just like that huh? play a solid game for two days then have my pocket kings run over 4 times, pocket queens another time.. 2 pair crushed.. and the list goes on. I actually was in such aww about this whole thing that I had to get my hand history. I think It’s just a total of about 200 hands, but why is it that this always seems to be the way? What I saw happening to me today I have never seen in my ten years of playing both live and online, best one was this hand. I’m playing short handed 6 pple, I’m dealt pocket aces on the button, everyone folds around seat 5 raises.. i reraise.. he calls.. flop comes xxj.. he leads out, once again I raise.. turn comes another jack… now I’m nervous..prob has A-J just made trips…anyway he checks gives me a free card and low and be hold and ace falls on the river…he bets..i raise..he’s all in..I call…he’s got 4 jacks…I’m sitting there holding my balls with a full house aces full of jacks..Now obviously this could very well happen in a live game as well..my point here is that all the sickest of the sick bad beats I have ever seen in my life all happened to me today, and I have the hand historys to prove it. I have never run so bad EVER, I really don’t see how it is possible for the so called online variance to always hit shortly after a deposit and if that is true that it is just variance because of so many hands being played, well then why doesn’t it seem to level itself out again? after all your playing so many hands the variance should come and go quicky, but your skill should still prevail. Anyway I know variance to be true, as I have had my bad runs and beats through out the 10 years of live playing, but this is totally unreal. I’m done pipe dreaming about having the luxury of playing from the comfort of my own home and will be back to playing strictly live at the casinos. I could vent forever about the BS that happens online as I have 6 years experience from it, I only wish I had all my hand historys to plug in to some data. Anyway good luck to all, I sincerely wish the best to anyone who is truly making it online, and to the others like myself, well we always have the live games we can still crush.

22. JOKERSTARS IS RIGHT
    March 15th, 2009 at 2:56 pm

    We have all been ripped off. It is extremely obvious. No one in the US gov gives a crap. Indian tribes are to moniter them but they are part of it. The only way around it is to quit playing online.
    The people who way in at these sites about how we are all just parinoid lossers are employeed by the sites.
    If you have played live for many years and now try online, most notice the bs right away and some take years to realize we are all being ripped off.
    Its not about action cards either, it is simply a computer program that takes money from real depositors while favoring house and site programed players.
    This goes on at every table on every site.
    Lets look at Jokerstars, there are more players at pokerstars than all the other sites added together (who accept Americans). Some are catching up by adding the filter programs and house and programed players. Many of the other sites have been caught and exposed for cheating.
    The only legitimate sites for Americans are the ones that quit accepting Americans when our authorities threatened them. They are the ones that are not overseen by indian tribes but are regulated by their governments (thats why they were/are fair) I used to almost make a living at Party Poker and Bet365 Poker. I only lose constantly at the remaining sites. I’ve tried them all until I see the filters and have no more options so I dont play online ever anymore.
    The US government should complete the job of shutting these online sites down for Americans who cant stop. It is their job, why arent they completing the shut down. Write your representatives your stories about being ripped off and maybe they will finish the job.
    I guess it would be too easy for them to simply tell the internet service providers to stop their transmissions.
    Oh well, maybe Ill see you at the honest, live games soon!!!!!!!!!!!

23. Yup..
    March 21st, 2009 at 2:29 pm

    100% Rigged… And I consider myself a poker GENIUS! 150 IQ mathmatical genius, I understand the game like einstein understood theory.

24. shrimpshackshooter
    March 24th, 2009 at 10:48 pm

    the algorithm is flawed. why cant they see this. why wont any pros come out and say its rigged.

25. shrimpshackshooter
    March 24th, 2009 at 11:04 pm

    also its really weird but it seems when i would withdraw i would lose some, but after a deposit they let me win, to get me suckd in . look up my stats on dr sayis on pstars, can you see when i deposited last, lol.

26. rbozz
    April 5th, 2009 at 10:00 pm

    I HAVE PLAYED ON FULL TILT FOR ALMOST 4YRS IT SEEMS WHEN I MAKE A DEP. I GET SOME REAL GOOD LUCK BUT IT THEN FADES I HAVE READ BOOKS 2 NO MY MATH PREETY GOODHAHA I PLAY TNYS MOSTLY WITHSOME SUCCESS MY STATS ARE ON ONLINE RANKINGS RECNTLY I HAVE MADE BIG BETS OR ALLINS AND BEEN CALLAD WITH UNDERS OR SOME CRAP HAND I AM LOSING WITH THESE AT 70% CLIP AND GET CALLED WHENTHEY JHAVE UNDERS THEY ALWAS SUCK OUT IWONT PLAY ON FT ANY MORE THE RNG IS FALSE IM NOT WORRIED ABOUT COLLUSION AND I KNOW U LOSE TO BAD PLAYERS SOMETIMES BUT 70% THATS BULL

27. big poker1
    April 19th, 2009 at 6:51 am

    Well, up until 6 months ago I wold have said you guys were nuts. I too, started off hot on on line poker, now, a good week is grinding at the 8-18 limit h/l tables and being up 600.00, and a bad day is being down $600.00!

    Little about myself. Without going into names, me and 2 of my buddies have been traveling, playing dif. casinos for about 1 1/2 now. We are all “winning players” even tho I carry most the load. They play tournies and NLHE were I stick to the biggest Omaha H/L cash games I can find (with 1 cash at the 2008 wsop pot limit o-8 game). I’ve been consistanly making money for 4 years playing poker, so no one can say I’m just a losing player.

    Back to the story at hand, how can I make 90k+ a year playing live poker with real players, and be down 10k a year playing with people who don’t have a clue online? The people I lose to are not winning players, they cap the rake and get lucky to be even or up alittle everyday. They chase gutshots on flushed boareds and will call off their stack for runner low for half the pot, and always get rewarded. “How is this profitable for the site” some ask, easy, if the bad players were not alloud to win more than their fair share of times, they wouldn’t play! I’m not talking about losing to a 80/20 situation 1 out of 4 times. I;m talking about them getting in 6-1 or worse, and winning 3 of 7 times, to keep them in the game. Then when the stack me, my intial response “I’m better than them, it eventually has to work out, numbers don’t lie”. So I buy back in. Only thing is, for the last 6 months in particular, the numbers have lied, BIG.

    If only good/winning players played online, there would be 7,000 at a time on full tilt, not 70,000! Thats why its worth it for them to minipulate the system.

    Why did I not want to give my name or screen name. My buddies and I pull cash games and sit and goes when one or all of us have lite rolls online, and if 3 guys that make 185k+ a year playing live have to cheat at a 33.00 sng, something is wrong.

28. papajoey21
    May 4th, 2009 at 3:30 pm

    Well nice to see a few guys with brains,big poker 1 you are 100% right.I wrote a very similar blog awhile back.If they don’t protect the weak their business is cut by 80% plain and simple.Ive dealt poker most of my life and now run a poker room and what comes out of my computer in no way resembles what takes place at my tables.I have been on a site called two plus two arguing with all them geniuses, but all they do is insult you because they have no idea.I am starting to think that it is the young guys who like to argue in defense of the sites because they don’t have anywhere near enough hours logged live to see the difference.these sites no it can be over any minutes and they are there to rape and pilage period..SORRY GUYS,WISE UP!

29. Rakeback
    June 25th, 2009 at 3:13 pm

    Good read, interesting stuff.

30. Jiggerj
    August 7th, 2009 at 2:35 pm

    I agree. Logic dictates that if I had a poker site with one player depositing $100 a week, and another player depositing only $10 per, then I’d want to stack the deck to keep the big money coming in. But, you wrote: “It makes absolutely no sense why the US is allowing BILLIONS of dollars to flow untaxed into the hands of possible criminals.” Tell me, have you ever played at pureplay.com? It’s out of Delaware and it’s the worst site on the net. Played hard there for a solid year and yeilded $ZERO! Fared not much better at other sites, but have won SOMETHING: pennies, a few dollars, and recently $200. No, judging by the lottery in my own state, the U.S. poker sites would be the most corrupt in the world.

31. greenja
    August 11th, 2009 at 10:36 am

    I am beginning to see the light finally. I have played solid poker online for 3 years. I have blamed my losses and variance and tilt. This last month on full tilt I believe showed me the truth. I went all in 7 times with KK versus AQ or AK and lost every one. I lost about 90% of my 50/50 situations, ie. QQ v. AK or vice versa. I kept trying to tell myself it is just bad variance, but I can’t convince myself of that anymore. My SNGs went horrible as well. About every slight favorite situation I was in I lost. When the small blind went all in with 2-6 against my AK and won, as a 2 hit, I think was my turning point. I put 600$ in about 2 months ago, built it up to 31K, then lost it all. I know I lost it all while playing solid poker at reasonable limits. I love playing poker, but i cant deny the truth any longer.

32. Wow
    August 14th, 2009 at 2:15 pm

    you guys are wrong, its not rigged. most of you just need to understand the game a bit more.

33. dumb walrus
    August 15th, 2009 at 3:56 pm

    are people really this stupid? i guess that’s why it’s so easy to make money at poker, online and live.

    what’s even more stupid than thinking online poker is rigged? thinking online poker is rigged and continuing to play!

    donks ftw.

34. Jennifear
    August 16th, 2009 at 1:31 am

    If online poker really was rigged, it wouldn’t be so easy to beat. You can tell that some of the people that commented on this thread have helped me and others like me fund the roof over my head.

35. no fear
    August 16th, 2009 at 8:07 am

    and Jennifear.. How do we know you are not one of them!!

36. greenja
    August 25th, 2009 at 12:39 pm

    The arguments used to support the validity of online poker are not good. They say the sites make so much money, why would they get greedy? Do I really need to answer this? Never underestimate human greed. Witness wallstreet. Also, they say there are consistent winners, like say, durr, phil ivey, leatherass, etc. Well, doesn’t it make sense for the sites to create consistent winners so that these winners will then serve as advertisement that poker is fair and the best players win?

    One day, when online poker is exposed as the farce that it is, I would like all the poker jackasses who were unknowingly propped up by the sites to return the money.

    G

37. Ted
    August 27th, 2009 at 10:18 pm

    After reading Paul Westin’s ‘Online Poker Code Crack’ I agree the sites are rigged. But as he points out, it is rigged toward certain players to win, if you look at the algorithms he discusses and the software he reveals, you can see why these people win and how they are doing it.
    Rigged? YES! but not the way you think!
    I recommend reading for any serious online poker player…

38. greg
    August 28th, 2009 at 8:24 am

    it is def rigged, i know alot of people say we’re just sore losers, but no that’s not the case. i play in real life and online and there’s no comparison. bad beats happen, yes, but not that ofter. alot of people say well, its because you play way more hands online in an hour than you do real life. wake up! when i first started playin online i couldnt lose. no matter what i had. but im a fairly good player. after puttin in a lil real money couldnt catch a hand to save my life, and it was like taunting me! back to back aa, kk, ak, etc. even hitting on the flop. but i didnt go all ape sh**. bet like i should of, kept getting suck out, even betting hard to make em fold, but oh no, the fish kept on calling with crap hands and hittin. it’s rigged people. listen to your gut. stick to real life tourneys if your half way any good.

39. Robert
    September 9th, 2009 at 1:37 am

    Greg and Ted are right about the rigged stuff, it just seems somedays you can’t win a pot to save your life and other days you win every single hand.
    I sat in a tourney and doubled doubled doubled from $4K to almost $70K inside of ten hands. That is hardly possible in a live tourney!
    There is something funny going on and Ted I did read Paul Westin’s Online Poker Code Crack, I think his program is right on target.
    The sites are def. rigged!

40. James
    October 16th, 2009 at 8:02 pm

    Poker is def. rigged. For example, if you play heads up sng tourneys… watch the all in bets cause, it’s always a drama board and usually the worst hand sucks out or makes an incredible hand. It’s so ridiculous these sites still are so poorly regulated. I for one know what it is to win at first and lose to bad players who make ridiculous hands. Oh, and forget about BJ, it is the most rigged game there is even though they claim they use the same number generator. Please do not donate your money to these sites. You may win in at first but will lose most if not all of your profits due to their software. They have statistics on every user and deal cards accordingly. Believe it… it’s true. I would say Ultimate Bet is up there with the worst. If you choose to play online poker which highly don’t recommend, please stay away from Ultimate Bet.

41. Jack'm
    November 28th, 2009 at 12:31 am

    A few years ago no one wanted to hear to these arguments. Many still don’t now, but far more folks are speaking out having had the same experiences. The algorythms are most intelligent in that they try to even out the percentages later so things are hard to quantify with a small sample size. Those who have tried to keep stats did it by hand, and stats seem to reveal a slight skew in favor of underdog hands on all-in hands.

    The rationale for this is to keep more players around longer. No-limit hold’em historically suffered an early death before, as all the bad players were busted out around 30 years ago. Online poker can’t afford that, and a stacked deck is the answer.

    It’s also very likely that not all the possible decks (a very large number) are being dealt out, with an emphasis given to decks that produce more action.

    In Sit-n-go’s and tourneys at a particular site, it seems everyone by now has noticed that the bigger stack wins a disproportionate amount of times, sometimes with the worst of hands. I’ve seen people saying they call with random hands because they know they’re big favorites no matter what when they have big stacks.

    I can also attest that new players also get blessed with unbelievable hands and unfathomable luck. If a player withdraws too much of his winnings, he’ll be punished and could even give it all back in losses if he’s not careful and stops playing for a while. Only a programmer would understand it’s not that hard to tag specific players to win or lose more in order to even things out. A player slated to lose would receive the most adverse luck no matter how good or bad the starting hands.

    All of this has also been noted by others here.

42. dumb walrus = retard
    December 12th, 2009 at 5:24 pm

    Reading through these comments has brought me feelings of content and happiness because it’s like reading an auto-biography of myself and my pokerstars experience if i were to write one. You all are pristinely on the money. Thank you so much. And by the way, for anyone who’s been ripped off to no end by pokerstars I’d highly recommend Full Tilt. The action flops, suckouts, and ridiculous bad beats are still there, but in much less abundance and it seems to reward you for good plays and punish you for bad ones. Still rigged; not what poker is all about, but good enough. At least it’s fair.

43. Raul
    January 13th, 2010 at 12:39 am

    Ok guys, i’ve been playing online poker for like 5 years now and my conclusion is that is totally rigged. It is impossible to win at online poker if you don’t know RNG. This guys that win constantly at online poker big tournaments, they have to know something. I believe that is all bout the RNG. I’m from Latin America and i also play at my local casino, with lot of tourists and very different players in all tourneys. I’ve managed to cash a lot of times, i mean lot and at online poker it seems to be harder. Not because of the amount players because that s irrelevant, its all about the structure of the tournament. With a good tournament structure, good knowledge about odds, good reads, the true random factor of the cards and agressiveness you can win constantly (Thanks to online poker rooms being rigged i studied more of course). I consider the ”winners” in online poker, scammers, they just figured out the algorithm of the RNG of course, they have studied it. And they are cashing BIG on it. I personally know one player that is awful at live play but he managed to win the SUNDAY MILLION and he’s been cashing for about 2 years now on a regular basis. Just check the pocket fives site and you will see this, they are always the same players but you don’t see them winning constantly in live play. Few of them won major tournaments but its only because some of them are very smart and studied before they figured out how online poker works. Yesterday and today i saw, in 6 times in different tables I was playing on, Four of a kind been made with one holding card and the other three of them on the flop. I dont know about the odds of that happening, it has to be hard for that to happen. Actually in live play ive seen that happen only once or twice in my life, and ive played as many hands as in online poker. Because of us player, this BILLIONAIRE companies will be unmasked soon, not because they want to cheat us, they actually didnt know that at the begginig. They not even know the growth online poker was going to have by this time now. Its because of the profits they make, they want to keep this as a secret and they wont be able to keep doing this for long time. And no, we wont be able to claim our money, theres only not enough to compensate everyone. So just as me, not play at any poker site until they actually fixed that issue. Or if you want try to figure out the shit for yourself or ask any ”winner” too see if they will tell something you dont know and maybe cash BIG as they do.

44. SavageChrist
    February 2nd, 2010 at 10:02 am

    For the longest time, I’ve suspected that online poker, especially at the lower limits, is “fixed” towards less than optimal players. And while I don’t believe it is, well this hand today definitely has me raising questions. The thing is this player was playing perfectly normal the whole game, solid OVR considering the stakes and game we were playing, as the 1st few hands of playing 3 handed got going. Then the below happened…

    Full Tilt Poker Game #18118402490: $1.50+$0.20 Sit&Go (Sup Turbo) (137010913), Table 1 – 30/60 – No Limit Hold’em – 10:21:22 ET – 2010/02/02
    Seat 1: MrPinkX (570)
    Seat 6: kracy49 (895)
    Seat 7: SavageChrist (1,235)
    SavageChrist posts the small blind of 30
    MrPinkX posts the big blind of 60
    The button is in seat #6
    *** HOLE CARDS ***
    Dealt to SavageChrist [Jd Jc]
    kracy49 raises to 895, and is all in
    SavageChrist calls 865
    MrPinkX folds
    kracy49 shows [4h Ks]
    SavageChrist shows [Jd Jc]
    *** FLOP *** [6s Kd 3s]
    *** TURN *** [6s Kd 3s] [Kh]
    *** RIVER *** [6s Kd 3s Kh] [5h]
    kracy49 shows three of a kind, Kings
    SavageChrist shows two pair, Kings and Jacks
    kracy49 wins the pot (1,850) with three of a kind, Kings
    *** SUMMARY ***
    Total pot 1,850 | Rake 0
    Board: [6s Kd 3s Kh 5h]
    Seat 1: MrPinkX (big blind) folded before the Flop
    Seat 6: kracy49 (button) showed [4h Ks] and won (1,850) with three of a kind, Kings
    Seat 7: SavageChrist (small blind) showed [Jd Jc] and lost with two pair, Kings and Jacks

    Tell me of 1 online player that would open shove K4o with >10 BB’s 3 handed, and from 1st to act also in those particular game and stakes. I know no1 would do that live, especially with lots of time left to play, whether it be for small stakes, or WSOP glory. Yes, I’ll gladly take JJ all day vs K4o preflop, but that’s not the point here. And don’t scream variance either, because this was way out of the blue for the player to do what they did in the above HH. Someone would only do that, IMO, if they knew what was coming, AND knew I was going to get dealt a hand to good to fold such as the JJ to call that massive donkey shove pre flop.

    Never in all my time playing those crazy STSNG’s have I seen anyone play that stupid preflop, and get rewarded for it. And it was totally unneccesary for him to do what he did at that stage of the SNG. I swear, 1/2 the time it seems, people plays these whack hands that they do, and its like they know what’s coming, hence why they treat it like AA, KK, etc. And before I get flamed, yes I know it was a $1.70 SNG, but its all I can play now as I try to build up from very little. It’s $hit like this that keeps me from ever wanting to deposit on these sites for significant $ again, where as I can buy $10 here and there from friends as I try to build up from those. Plus I don’t have to pay all of the darn deposit fees since the US player’s options are so limited now. I remember when I could put in with my Debit Card, then when that avenue got blocked, it was epassporte, then when that got blocked, bank CC, and now that that’s blocked, I haven’t put another dime in since…

    I’ve also noticed many “pattern hands” myself, along with the “cash out curse” and the run of good fortune when you put $ in / open an account for the 1st time, and immediate also. And seeing how there are many others who noticed these same things that I did, makes me not so paranoid then…

    So is it rigged? I honestly do not know, although at times it does have that “feel” of manipulation, whether it be good or bad. It’ll be interesting to see what is unearthed down the road.

45. Jared
    February 10th, 2010 at 6:59 pm

    I LOL at the peeps who cannot see it is clearly rigged.

    It surely IS random. Random WITHIN a set of given parameters. Those parameters are primarily redistribution of funds.

    The more the money in the site is redistributed, the more it is played, the more rake is taken. It’s simple.

    That’s why when nearing the bubble in MTT’s and specially SnG’s that take longer than normal you will see the usual increase in pocket hole cards. This, obviously is to thin the field, award the prizes, and get everyone back to playing more tournaments/ring games etc…

    Also, shaving 10% off the time it takes to finish a tournament shaves 10% off the cost of data hosting those tournaments. No point in wasting traffic costs when the money has already been made.

    These sites have NO legal obligations whatsoever to you, and you have NO legal recourse.

    Slot machines are random – but within set parameters, they obviously have to make a profit, which they do, a percentage at a time. Overall, slots payout big and small, but always remain a winner, the standard house edge.

    Pokerstars is the same. It’s random within a set of parameters. There is no house edge at Pokerstars, just the rake. And the redistribution of funds is primarily achieved through action flops/drama boards.

    It’s JUST like slot machines.

    Stars and Tilt are set to redistribute funds. It’s up to us to capitalise on this, and the better players do.

    Chris Ferguson even set up the Full Tilt Poker Academy to show you exactly how to play to minimise loss/maximise profit during chip redistribution. He actually tells/shows you how to play to suit the redistribution algorithm at FullTilt and come out ahead.

46. mpdzwlduwa
    March 10th, 2010 at 7:10 pm

    zzeGLu dsfzfzfgpulm, [url=http://aqqjedhhxsic.com/]aqqjedhhxsic[/url], [link=http://pvqxbdivxbrt.com/]pvqxbdivxbrt[/link], http://cihyhvvobisv.com/

47. redc69
    March 19th, 2010 at 4:04 pm

    interesting

48. redc69
    March 19th, 2010 at 4:16 pm

    i have been playing 4 two yrs ! and i say the same as you guy’s !!mi not that good but i read alot ! and study and watch tv ! iknow t v is diff. but the cards that come out r unreal !for me or against ,i do odds play best hole cards , mix it up reraise call etc. bad beats sometimes i set out for long time then come in and win then catn buy a hand !?and lose it ! B BTS !!! I ONLY pla free tornys . is tere any decent site out ther !! plzz let me us know !! thanks[ keep on chipn]

49. redc69
    March 19th, 2010 at 4:17 pm

    are ther really poker bots ??

50. RapPat58
    April 11th, 2010 at 8:20 am

    I play most of the time on Full Tilt Poker and I like to put all my money in when the odds are right.
    I did not count the number of occasions when I lost the pot being a 3 to 1 or even 4 to 1 favorite yet, but I will do that soon since I am getting really tired.
    I would like to know what you all think about this particular hand and give me some explanation.
    Early stage of a Sit & Go tournament (10$ + 1).
    Full table (9 players)
    Blinds are 30 $-60 $ and your stack is 2295 $ on the button.
    Small blind with 1720 $
    Big blind with 1860 $
    Everybody folds to you and you pick up K :s Q :d .

    What is your action?
    Suppose you raise to 180 $.
    The small blind folds but the big blind calls for another 120 $.
    The pot is 390 $.
    How do you rate your hand? Well, at least you have position.
    The flop is 6 :h 7 :d A :c
    The big blind checks.

    What is your action?
    Suppose you decide to bluff with a 240 $ bet.
    You get checkraised to 560 $.
    The pot is now 1190 $.
    There is no flush draw so it look like the big blind had a weak ace (aces up?) or suited connectors (6-7) for two pair. Maybe a straight draw with 4-5 or 8-9. Any other brilliant ideas?

    What is your action?
    Suppose you continue with your bluff and raise to 1200 $ (you now have 1095 $ left).
    The big blinds goes all in for 1680 $
    The pot is 3270 $.

    What is your action?
    It costs you 480 $ (it’s about 1 to 7) to call but what are your chances to win with your total bluff? May I remind you that you do not have a pair…?
    Judging by the betting of the big blind you must be against aces up so not even two pairs would help (KQ).
    You need to hit exactly running kings or queens or running cards for a broadway.
    For those who are unfamiliar with odds calculation your chance of winning is 2.22%.
    Would you bet more than 80% of your stack?
    I wouldn’t but RoseYump did and of course received on the turn J :h and on the river T :s .

    Anybody else had similar experiences with this player?

    I believe that the only explanation for this behavior is that you can see all cards (board included).

    Comments are welcome.

51. oldgroper
    April 17th, 2010 at 2:07 am

    I play both online & live. For me, ol is clearly rigged. It’s not just the bad beats, it’s the pattern that they follow which gives it away. It’s best to consider these sites as slot machines. For every $1 you put in, you’ll get maybe 70c back over time.

    I’m a software engineer and I always give a LOL when I see the big delay before the turn card is dealt(not sure if anyone’s mentioned this). This happens when the program is trying to calculate who to & how it should pay the money out. If it wasn’t rigged, it would just give us the card everytime.

52. Poker is Rigged
    May 9th, 2010 at 11:46 am

    Online poker is certainly rigged. I have questioned it every time I make a deposit. Overall I am even or up a bit, so I am not a donk. However, I tend to win in streaks in lose in an insane string of bad beats. The last one was capped off by a 2%er after the flop. Whenever I play now if I am on a win streak I will win when I am ahead and suck out on occassion. When I am on a losing streak I will lose when I have players dominated pre-flop or absolutely crushed post flop.

    If you are questioning whether online poker is rigged, ask yourself this. When you are in a pot post flop and the money goes in, why are you uncomfortable when your opponent has a 5-15% chance of sucking out. If you have this same thought, believe it your intuition is right. Online poker is most definitely rigged. Do what I am doing, stop putting money in. Get your poker fix from home games or trips to casinos. Don’t give these sites another cent.

53. david webber
    May 23rd, 2010 at 2:41 pm

    i know these people are right. they are better poker players than the others online. that ain’t hard to prove. those winners that win online couldn’t warm a seat, but i don’t think these complainers can beat me. in a live , unrigged , impossible to cheat game no one wants to lose here. they go to a casino(another rigged crooked dump with anti-poker , feed the house your money faster idiot greedy rules that are not poker. they look for the 99% online sucker for a quick and very easy free lunch, and they always get it too.

54. david webber
    May 23rd, 2010 at 4:26 pm

    to savagechrist. at poker stars i have won 6 of the last 57 times i have got aa. and was called by only one player 52 times and only 2 players the other 5 and ive been playing at stars for 5 1/2 years. and have played a good amount at 28 other sites(had 23 on my desktop at the same time for awhile. every table in every game at everysite is rigged the same way. they all deal the same exact crap as a few scumbags i know in the live world from before online poker ever existed. and bet it the same too. but they can only do it on their deal, and won’t call a bet on anyone elses deal either.

55. david webber
    May 23rd, 2010 at 4:35 pm

    to raul- the casinos live will pay more for a card magician . why? that is obvious. to make them more money. the players are getting crooked there too.
    the only random dealing is what you do when you shuffle the cards last.

56. david webber
    May 23rd, 2010 at 6:40 pm

    for all you guys that wrote before me—there are tons of poker cheat software out there. some work , but some are a scam just like online poker sites. some seemed incredible. like the ones that agree with you that the sites and some of the players that don’t make sense are cheating you. so i bought one for $50 to see what this guy had. what i got was what i paid for. but it did me no good. after 2 hands it showed the 5card table and what 2 other players had. the 5 card table was 98% exact. 1 wrong card every 10 hands(49of 50). why is it no good? because the 5 coming up never improved my 2 start cards. and very seldom improved the other 2 hands either as to why those were folded almost every time as well and not shown from not being played. all this at stars. so they have been dealing me out intentionally the entire time.(5years+)and they are doing you the same way, as you say. now when i worked for $3 an hour 50 years ago , i used to play every week for$2-$4 in homegames. i used to lose to older experienced guys that have been playing longer than i alive. lost all the time, but they never were cheating. one was related to a guy i graduated from school with. and we (the school friend and his uncle) would do other things together like go to the horse track and bet the sports cards(pick 4 pays 9for 1 all 4 must win) he helped me with thinkng the game . i quit losing almost instantly using his hints and refined my game even better with thinking further. i also read a lot of books about poker from the library. they had good advice but i was already better by then. so they weren’t much help, but gave me enforcement i was now in the right direction. what these dolts call the new school of thought has been around for a long time(as a loser compared to what i was reading out of books written in the 50′s and 60′s. the best were about how to think the game and how the others played. not systems or pot odds(systems are for losers) and pot odds are a useless system. does not generate profits. only adds to losses(sending good money after bad. in the long run it won’t come back let alone bring the other with it)
    every so often you run into a deck stacking cheat in the live world( they deal the exact same shit as online sites and bet and play it the same way. they can’t do anything else. they stick out as a phony pile right off the bat. they haven’t got a clue and won””t bet or call on anyone elses deal. a couple tried to play by theirselves on my deal and with avg. cards i ate their pockets raw for lunch.not a cent left. with aa or 2 small pair in 7 stud. the only hand the entire time these clowns won were on their deal or when i folded. not a showdown on sonmeones deal other than their own.i haven’t seen them since before online poker started. i am convinced they are making money with their rng and siting in the seats knowing where the cards are. seeing as how they disappeared and no has seen them since. these kind never learn. if someone broke their thievin neck, they still trying from a wheelchair online.and assumed name so no one finish the job they deserve.

57. david webber
    May 23rd, 2010 at 7:38 pm

    to papajoey and hook118-you are at least 100% absolutely correct(probably more) after 1 year online i started predicting what they were gonna deal before they did. i could only do this by going all in and seeing what the callers had. then they would get the card or cards that would beat me ,almost every single time. and for real money , it is totally automatic. and i never seen players this fckin lousy ever do anything but go broke , even if they had incredible luck by winning 2or3 of these miracle suckouts the 1st hands they played. other wise they only got some of their money back before being farther behind than the last time they won before they luck out again. in a live unrigged game where everyone shuffles the cards in a blind so no on can crook the deal. these dolts would not warm a seat. it is hard to find players of this caliber in the live world because someone else knows them 1st as to why you never see them2nd(due to lack of funds to continue further)

58. david webber
    May 23rd, 2010 at 8:03 pm

    if you ever see dweemson at poker stars, you will not see better. and you will never wnt to play him live , unless you like losing. you won’t be able to cheat ,but you will get to deal every hand if you want. casinoes don’t have real poker either. holdem is not real poker, no limit is not poker,only a sucker punch. tournies are not poker, just a lottery. real poker is a true test, like baseball, no one has an advantage without earning it. limit poker where the antes and stakes never increase. the game stays the same for 6-10 hours before anything is proved , then only for that period of time who was better that day. got nothing to do with who is better or best. that needs more games.more hands more time til one guy gets tired of losing, wants no more . but in multi player games the best is the omnes who consistently wins the most times he plays. now i played regular with the best guys i could find(those are the ones that love the game and show up every week and are all better than any joke online for a fact. i turned down saturday 1 1/2 time at gm tool+die ($150 take home for that day to play $1ante, $10 limit with 3 raises. and wouild win 5 weeks of 6(avg.) the 5 wins minus the one lose divided by the total six games avg. $325-350 a day(6-10 hours) and online players(at least 99% of them are a total imbecile compared to these guys)dealers choice where every one had a different game from the others a couple had 2-3 different games from the others and i had dozenz for my deal. look at that game at paradise poker called pineapple, i like that , but we had a couple dozen games like that and all were better than that one.

59. david webber
    May 23rd, 2010 at 8:28 pm

    i went to school with a guy that lived right across from the h.s entrance that i walked 3/4 mile every day to reach. he was on the main rd. because his dad was an accountant working from his house. this guy was the class clown(because he didn’t need school) but his dad learned him all he needed to know and was paying him to do a lot of it forthe old guy. so his career was made for him. now when i was going around playing cards , a lot of store owners and businesses that needed inventory and taxes done would hire this guy to pay him to do them. and these guys would lose to me in card games. he knew where our games were from these guys talking cards when they get together. but he never came to our games. now i found another guy at the local store near where i live now that knows my classmate. he tells me the accountant kept his books for years, but he doesn’t anymore because he has only 1 store and can do it without help. this guy goes to casinoes and looks for online types to get $200-300 from in 2-3 hours. but he will stay to beat the regulars there for 6-8 hours to get it. he won’t play with me, only holdem with dolts(because it is fast and easy like tic-tac-toe)he wants no part of complicated thinking games. he says the guys that have real card experience have him greatly overmatched. but while he was going to detroit (75miles away) toaccept donations from the idiot holdem players he ran into my accountant school guy a number of times. he told me that tony(the account.) was there playing nolimit, he puts up $1000 and looks at 1-2 flops an hour and wins all showdowns(1-2) and leaves with about$4000 everytime he sees him. he also makes $250,000 a year as a 1 man firm. but we graduated in ’66 and i never seen him in any card game although he knew where they were all at. but then again, people that can handle simple games like holdem and 5stud. are intimidated by games that need more brainwork. and memory. and tons more possibilities.

60. david webber
    May 23rd, 2010 at 8:36 pm

    a general foreman at the buick motor div. where one of our regular weekly players worked came to our weekly and lost $300+ then came back 2 weeks later and said” thanks fellas, for the education i got here the last time. it was well worth the $300. i went to lv last week and took those imbeciles for $1300 in 3 hours” he was asked”what did you play for how much? his answer? ” poker $10 limit”

    ‘

61. david webber
    May 23rd, 2010 at 8:57 pm

    do you know anything about cards? the original game was draw. no antes a hand because of 5 cards (one for each finger). no antes because the dealer showed his merchandise to try to sell. like real world, it costs nothing to look around. then you tell him to keep[ it or you buy it. then someone might start an auction. (raising) til the winner is decided. stud poker(5card) was next. still only a handful. then to get more bets 7stud was next (extra cards to make hand,like draw) also more bets to build pot. we played these and invented all kinds of variations off them. 6stud (with 2 down 1st and last or 2down 1st, some times 2down 1 up sometimes 2downand bet before rest up.) 5stud last one down, (this game is better than holdem, but is the easiest game we ever played) old poker books never mentioned tex holdem, but all kinds of community card games like crisscross(a terrific game) cincinnati(5 hole cards and the 5 up cards 1 at a time with bets after each..

62. david webber
    May 23rd, 2010 at 9:15 pm

    when i went to the library in ’67 or ’68 i got a book that was written by the u.s. army about cheating at poker as observed in the barracks card games. a good place to observe thievin trash, when they aren’t thievin someone else. they thieve each other(i think it is called ‘honor among thieves’) this book had just about everything that has ever been thought of and was copyrite 1950 or very close to it. now on your search engine look up poker cheating live or poker cheating offline —neo-cheaters. this book has about 4 sections of all kinds of cheating in life. one section is about poker. it is written by a medical doctor but his friend was a professional poker player in lv. in lv they have dealers, no one deals their cards. this guy gave the doc lots of examples of cheating from the ’60′s as the book was written about ’68 there was no holdem then, he was playing 7stud. he learned how to stack the deck, but couldn’t cheat with a dealer. but he could spot the dealer cheating and not get crooked by the dealer(why he learned what is involved? to be able to protect himself from thievin garbage is obvious) there isn’t a thing in that neo-cheater book that wasn’t in the army book about it.

63. david webber
    May 23rd, 2010 at 9:26 pm

    now let me enlighten you . poker is a game of skill, right? i played with a guy that died about 5 years ago at 94 years old. played cards with him often in games with guys he knew at their house or his. when a young guy tried to hit a miracle tom save his lost money this old guy had all kind of sayings dropping himnts to the uneducated lotto player who appeared to have no clue(like 99% of online) such as “he who relies on luck is already lost” or”confucious say’he who cannot fold losers cannot possibly win’” or “he who cannot fold a possible winner has no chance or hope of being a winner”

64. david webber
    May 23rd, 2010 at 9:36 pm

    now his brother that died 57 years old 20 years earlier. used to say to guys that played like these dolts online ” sonny, are you aware of the fact that if you get caught bluffing, you lose?”and i figured out that if i ain’t got the cards, someone does. and i gave more away to be a bigger loser. for chump, change antes 10 won gone in 1 caller. it seems obvious playing every hand is an automatic loser for ex. 7 guys means 1 winner to a seat every hand on avg. win 1 of 7 and only break evenbut can’t get even because everyone won’t call to give you your losses back. that makes those old sayings absolutely correct

65. david webber
    May 23rd, 2010 at 10:49 pm

    to ford 1/22/09—i never had a royal flush live in 30 years, and only 5 in 30 years(at least 52 card games [6-10hours] a year. and we played all kinds of games with lots of cards and lots chances like 65 h/l this game gives you 6 hole cards and 5 board cards everyone gets. cincinnati h/l with 5 hole cards and 5 community cards is in old poker books , but not holdem. we never played holdem because no one ever heard of it. when they did, it was obviously the garbage game we didn’t have and no on wanted to play it. one guy said why play that shit, we might as well go back to 5 stud with 1 hole card. and get no action. who ever is high bets and everyone else folds. you imbeciles cannot beat these guys, they won’t give you their money. and theyt will never put up money not matched by everyone in the hand. no blinds and no other kind of forced betting. they got it right. you that let others manage your money can’t complain you ain’t got it after YOU gave it away

66. david webber
    May 23rd, 2010 at 11:24 pm

    papa, what makes you think u.s . regulation is better? you suckass? everyone has it better than regulation, an infringement of your rights. politicians regulated thaladomide which ruined a couple hundred thousand babies in the fifties and hasn’t improved at all in the years since. casinoes do not have a game , also legalized by politicians. for instance, in our home games we make the rules. like a business we have to be the best or no one shops here. try this, no rakes except to pay for beer pop coffee and food provided by the house and fixes the food ready to eat. if everyone brought their own there would be no rake at all. $1 ante $10 limit 7 player table with $2 rake of $7 ante for each hand . rake stops at $125 as the house spent $100 for all the food and drinks./ if play is only 5 the rake is $1of$5. for the games that don’t last as long to get to $100 all left overs stay til next week and house does not have to buy as much. however you can buy the beer and pop extra to take with you if you want. extra food house will eat as leftovers next two days. then they don’t lose either. sometimes game last as long as 14 hours with rake gone after 6-7hours. compare that to regulation. $2 of $7 ante rake and not a cent more for up to 600$pots. they take with holding taxes $2 of $7 every hour on the job, vacation checks, bonuses, profit-sharing. and $3 of $8 for saturday money alone and $1 of $2 for sunday money where i worked . this is a fact and it was 20 years before i retired in ’97 at $23/hr when i made about$7/hr

    .

67. david webber
    May 23rd, 2010 at 11:28 pm

    and they don’t giveyou a fckin thing for any of it either, airbag

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68. david webber
    May 24th, 2010 at 12:00 am

    big poker 1—- you sound to me like a guy that has a lot of money , but not from playing cards. i bet you cannot win in a night of cards with me and people i know that play cards. you go for tournies. that is not poker, just another state regulated lotto. allin poker is not poker only a lucky sucker punch. or tommy hearns duking it out with hagler to get ko’d in round 2or3. hearns lost to hagler fighting his fight and leanard too. opposite way though. you lose crap shooting with the other guy at his game. but you could get lucky. but he who relies on luck is already lost.

69. david webber
    May 24th, 2010 at 12:33 am

    a guy i new(deceased was a multimillionaire , he got it all from his profession and investments . he used to go to vegas and lose 10k ( a drop in the bucket for him) it would be like me with $300 in my wallet and playing 1c-2c limit for 50c buy-inand quit when i am done or lose the 50c. he bought a book in lv that told the facts about lv according to nick the greek. as the book was a biograpghy of nick with thinking and views on other things as well as gambling. it is proof lv is rigged to to cheat or scam the customers. this was before the card sites online ever existed. does it make sense to you that the casinoes would quit thievin with people staying home to play online. or does crooking more seem the answer to replace lost business.
    the lv casinoes are run by the state as to why they are garbage compared to mafia backed interests as independent businessmenyears earlier. more rigged than ever before. my millionaire friend left mich. to live in lv after retiring from his profession. why? he said they have no taxes [state or property.] they take them from the casinoes for state expense and their schools
    now these people cannot afford to lose and not meet their budget or salaries. that have to be paid. the voters won’t pay taxes for any of it. they got voting support they won’t have trying to take the voters money. aLL the incentive to thieve the mafia didn’t need. politicians know nothing , and about everything at that. they haven’t got a clue how be a winner in any business. they just thieve the woinners to get money they can’t get any other way. but these pirate slobs think when they thieve a successful business they stole the customers with it to keep shopping their money there. they find theirselves burning lights for no customers spending no money to pay for them opening up for nothing. for instance, the cops bust everybody leaving a very busy hotspot bar. for drinking and driving under very arbitrary drunkeness judgements(the worthless gashes have never stopped trying the impossible, prohibition of none of their business) the customers have their money thieved and can’t patronize the business. then they steal the proprty for back proprty tax for their schools and then their athletic supporters for these apple pickin twats buy them for back taxes. and the highway girl scouts open up with theirselves as their only customers. now because drinking and driving is dangerous they get to drink as thieved it new owner at wholesale prices as their only customer. but after drinking up the stolen money in their stolen place. property tax is due. hahahahahahahahaand these slobs are not walking home either. thus proving these non-liars are enforcing the law equally for everyone. because they aren’t anyone.so much for fairest management by politicians and their imbe ile suckassholes

70. david webber
    May 24th, 2010 at 12:54 am

    i know a guy that does computers and papa joey says his computer game is NOT like his live game he deals. did i miss something not said here. he is telling us he is thieving like the other sites he is criticizing. talk about kettles call their pots in the set black/did he have to buy the rng software as part of getting a licence or did he choose to buy it himself. how would his site be any different with out programming personally to the exact % of random as mixed and dealtby the players all, shuffling the cards before each hand. yes it would take longer. but no one is complaining about unfair and winners will win and losers will not be spending the winners earned money. and the crooks will fly out the door when they can’t thieve by playoing solitaire with the other players money because of unfair thieved advbantage

71. david webber
    May 24th, 2010 at 1:07 am

    now the computer technician i know says it would cost less to deal the cards without the rng analizing the hand to pick cards to help the idiot losers to stay in the hand. why do they pay more? to get even more from choreographing the outcomes. how is that random or fair to any of their customers? he also told me that the cards do not come from any shuffling the cards that go to the seats will be they same with a full table as with only 2 players. unless the players get a different seat, they will get the same cards in that seat. example . they shuffle(haha) and someone fails to post blinds or antes. that does not change the cards to be dealt like in live game. in other words if the dealer was rigging the deck, and someone figured to be in the hand was counted to get the spacing correct sits out , the planned fix would be fcked .

72. david webber
    May 24th, 2010 at 1:42 am

    ask yourself why casinoes invented holdem to replace draw and stud. try this–it is much faster to deal less cards, faster to flop 3 instead of1 at a time, and bet after each 1 like in stud, the best excuse is the one thieves like–it is easier to stack the deck which cannot be unstacked no matter what anyone does as far as staying in or folding or how many cards they draw(keeping a kicker or drawing 3 to a pair). i knew an old guy that told me a story you might like- a guy he knew about 10 years before the day he related this TRUE story to me. i started working for 2.80 an hour in 1967. he said this happened about 10 years earlier. ” a guy i knew wanted me to drive him to a card game, and wait for him as long as it took but he expected it wouldn’t take more than 1/2 hour and when we got there he said to park in view of the entrance. when he came out , i was supposed to drive up as fast as i can and pick him up at the curb. i asked him what was wrong with his car, and he said it wasn’t starting right. i asked why not take a cab? and he said he wanted to go now and leave as soon as possible with no delay to call the cab and wait for it in either direction. he’d give me $100 for this(more than a weeks takehome at $2.80 an hour) this guy came out of the card game and ran into the car 2 houses closer to me before i got close enough to pick him up. and said” get out of here before they see your car, at least before they can get you license plate no.” what the problem i asked. he said he made an incredible killing, he knew they’d be easy but he didn’t expect it to be this good. 2 blocks away after a couple of turns out of sight he said” slow down and turn to go straight back, no sense getting stopped for traffic ticket now” . and took the money out and counted over $17,000 and tipped the extra over the 17k $another $200+ he paid the original$100 before going in. i said ” what you do , rob em?” he said”some people might call it that. but all i did was deal the cards and they bet it to me”

    ‘

73. david webber
    May 24th, 2010 at 1:47 am

    does that sound like the probable thinking of online sites seeing as how with assumed names nobody can bother them. find out who they are or where they are?

74. david webber
    May 24th, 2010 at 1:54 am

    how about a women says she marries for love , not money, and for life. then gets a divorce and thieves money she didn’t want(not interested in it) thieves your kids(kidnapping for ransom, after ransom after ransom and you pay over and over and never are done and get them back-like dope addiction-just keep paying forever)it called child support. and spend the money on everything else and have the friend of court see if you making more so she can get more. politicians, as you see, are a sucker for her lovely self

75. david webber
    May 24th, 2010 at 1:57 am

    these kind have been around since forever ago, hiding out like this online scam is a dream come true. no risk like jesse james might get shot in back riding away from back with the loot

76. david webber
    May 24th, 2010 at 1:57 am

    that was bank , not back

77. david webber
    May 24th, 2010 at 2:28 am

    you can prove it to your self. take a deck of cards and check it out. i can figured out the exact odds but not as easy when i got nothing but a’s in math all through school in math graduated when 17 in ’66. . i know that the total number of possible out comes in exact order from 52 cards is 52x51x50 all the way to x2. now some of the same identical hands will be repeated, only in a different order. the 1st 23 will be repeated for all the possibilities
    from the last 29 (none of which ever get to the top 23)52 cards x51 x50 multiplying by one less than the last every time til you multiply x30 are your odds frequentcy of any one exact order of the 23 dealt in 9 player holdem. to get any card card is automatic , to match it is 1in 17 if you do that on a bet you get that on a side bet you should get 16-1 odds. if some one gives you better odds you should take it but should bet it enough to make it pay if they give you worse you should fold (not take the bet)at 16-1 your betting only to break even so why bet? you were even without wasting time trying to get back to it

78. david webber
    May 24th, 2010 at 2:49 am

    the odds of getting an ace is 1in 13(4 aces in 52 card poker deck) the odds of getting a second after the 1st are 1 in 17(the other 3 of the 51 left)therefore the expected frequency of getting aa is 1 every 221 hands of 2 cards(13×17). these odds are the same for each player on every table for every hand, doesn’t matter what game you are playing or how many are in the game(even just you in solitaire)the odds are exactly the same for any of the other 12 values if designated before a card is dealt to the person name what pair they want(in other words you should see any other particular pair no more or no less than aa -13 different pairs in 221 hands once each.

79. david webber
    May 24th, 2010 at 2:58 am

    once at bugsy;’s club i got aa 6 times in 8 conseq=cutive hands and went all in every time and won against all that called every time. it was like the real world in the respect they are hard to beat (very hard to beat in an unrigged game)and very surprising for online. at poker stars 6 wins in the last 57 times dealt aa, not current, quit checking on it last 4 days, and only one caller 52 times and 2 callers the other 5

    0

80. david webber
    May 24th, 2010 at 3:09 am

    about ’68 or ’69 in a 7 man 5stud hand i got aa , bet the 5$limit, guy behind me made it$10 showing k. i said”you can beat aces, kid? he said ” you got aces?” i said “i make it $15″ , all others folded $10 to them. he said “ok, i shut up, but i got to see it” . if he paired the next 2 cards, i check and call and he would most likely bet. even without k in hole. if kk wins against a showing, ak does not lose to it either.so now i got to see kk.

    ‘

81. david webber
    May 24th, 2010 at 3:26 am

    never lost with aa in 5 stud in my life, but only only had it 2-3 times as we play dealers choice and then we found better games or invented them more possibilities means more players playing , not folding. we quit playing it altogether after about 1975. now at bodog they have 5stud . i
    was over there for awhile and deposited $500 but had no intent to bet big.just get the $50 bonus. did not have to play so many hands either . i stayed because the guy referred me was slow in getting his refrrral bonus($100) so i tinkered around for 50c-1.00won a little less than 100bucks had between 600-650while i was on the 5 stud table about the 10-15 hand after folding all the others they give me aa wired and the guy after me had low making it convenient to play last.he had that garbage bringin-a crooked scam- and had to beta guy acroo raised wit 9 showing and 2 others before me with 9 beat(what a dolt)i let the azzhole dimbecile(you know? the bright idiots?)bet my hand , he all tha way on a loser before the last card i bet and he raised bet

82. david webber
    May 24th, 2010 at 3:33 am

    he hit a pair on board and had hit a pair to hole card the card before . he raised on k9 and bett everytime til he paired k on 4th card and then paired the 9 showing on last. then i sat out 2 times around, wheni got back in they gave me aa again and the same jackass bet a loser all he could then hit twice last 2 again. 2for 2 on line, 0for 30 year history livei only got it 203 times and never lost, but i nebver seen anyone else lose with it either probably 8-10 more times

83. david webber
    May 24th, 2010 at 3:34 am

    2-3 times not 203 times

84. david webber
    May 24th, 2010 at 3:43 am

    my friend who i never played against, told me that in holdem aa wins 40% of time according to what he read in poker magazine. asked what i thought of that? i said that is shit if only playing heads up , might be right if full table of 9-10 all are in. he said ” oh my, you are really very good”. i told this to 30 guys that play cards and they all said “really, do you believe that?” he said these don’t play bad like online either or online types at casino(the sitting ducks in the live world unless they playing casino money.) the difference, the sitting ducks are dead in water,but the casino props (what the live house bots are called) have magic rigged rising from the dead(are those guys named lazarus?)

85. rangerjoe
    August 23rd, 2010 at 11:12 pm

    ok im gonna throw my instances in here. on pokerstars i had a bankroll of 22k that i did off of a 100 dollar buy in won all of it in cash games. i did a 5k cashout cuz thats all the sitewould let me pull out after that i lost the other 17k almost instantly to unreal beats over and over and over. first i was man thats just a run of bad luck so then i try full tilt i deposit a 100 bucks and run it to 13k same thing i do a 3k cashout and lose the other 10k back to some very odd things mean some of the players ar the table actually felt bad when they seen some of the hands ill give you a instance that i see way to much online. in my hand i raise the and and remember i am playin a 30/60 limit game. im on the button kk i raise guy utg reraises but wait he jumped on the table and posted utg? hmmm why not wait a hand for the bb but any way we cap the pot the flop is kh 5d 3c we cap the flop the turn is 9c he keeps lead betting and reraising the river is 10c. pot is capped guy utg shows jc 2c for back door flush and jumps immediately off the table and i could never track him on the site again. these are just instances i wanna give. i refuse to play online im a very succesful live tourney and cash game player. this is what i wanna do i want to know what we have to get these sites shut down. they are stealin billions of dollars from players and really makin people believe poker is like a bingo card. so guys who ever is with me lets really get it together and do whatever it takes to shut these games down!!! lets take a stand !! no more

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